Nicole Takesono Flowers: Leading with Empathy from the Opera Stage to Higher Ed

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There were very long days, but
as I explained to my nephew who

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said to me one time, Auntie
Nicole, how do you work so much?

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And I said, the end of my day is
like dessert.

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It's work.
It's not easy and I'm just

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hanging out.
But it's when, when it's

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something that feeds your soul,
it's really easy, easy to keep

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going.
I'm delighted to be speaking

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with Nicole Take Sono Flowers,
opera singer and higher Ed

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administrator.
Originally from Hawaii, Nicole

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has garnered a claim for her
rich, warm mezzo soprano voice

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and profound dedication to
storytelling.

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She has graced the stages of
esteemed companies such as the

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San Francisco Opera Opera San
Jose, W Edge Opera, Festival

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Opera, and West Bay Opera.
Recently, she's shifted her

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focus to recital work,
collaborating closely with

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guitarist Sharon Wayne.
For over 20 years, she has

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served as an administrator at
UCSF, where she is currently the

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program manager for the
Biophysics Grad program.

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In 2022, she was awarded the
Chancellor's Award for

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Exceptional University Service
at UCSF.

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Nicole, welcome to the show.
Thank you so much.

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It's a pleasure to join you.
You you grew up in Hawaii and

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it's obviously a big part of who
you are Growing up.

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What did you think was possible
in terms of your career paths

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and did you imagine you'd be
living the life that you have

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today?
I went to an amazing elementary

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school called Hanahalli, which
means happy work.

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It was very small at the time.
There was one class per grade,

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so 25 kids per grade.
It's expanded a little bit now,

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but it's still very small and
very nurturing.

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And I credit that school as well
as my parents with giving me

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this idea that I can do whatever
I want as long as I put my mind

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to it.
Fast forward a little bit down

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the line.
When I was in high school,

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that's when I thought I I wanted
to become an opera singer.

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And when I was a senior in high
school, let's see, it was second

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semester, senior year.
I'd already done my college

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applications.
My mom and I took off for maybe

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about a week and we came to San
Francisco.

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It was February, I believe, so
there was no opera at the time.

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So we got tickets to the ballet
and I remember sitting in the

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War Memorial Opera House
watching the ballet, being in

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this beautiful theater and
thinking this is amazing, I want

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to work here someday.
Then Fast forward a little bit

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more, 2005 I think it was, I was
actually contracted to work for

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the ballet.
They were doing the West Side

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Story suite and they hired 3
female singers and 1 male singer

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to beef up the sound with the
ballet, the ballet dancers.

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And I was sitting in the pit and
I remembered when I was in high

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school thinking that I wanted to
be there.

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And there I was, full circle.
Wow, wow.

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I actually have been a pit
singer also.

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This was in college, though.
It was for a production of

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Chorus Line and A Chorus Line.
And you know, they're leaping

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everywhere, so they needed
soprano.

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That was me.
Connect the dots for us as a

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young singer.
What was that path like leaving

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Hawaii, getting to San Francisco
and finding opportunities to

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sing?
So when I graduated from high

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school, I went to College in
Boston.

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And I want to add that I think
that the name of your show is so

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great, the ampersand.
I am biracial and I think in

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every facet of my life I have
always straddled a line, whether

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it's, you know, ethnically or
professionally.

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I could never, I could never
conceive of just being a singer.

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That seemed way too risky.
And I always needed to have a

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sort of backup plan or another
job.

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So when I was in college, I
started off as a double major in

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economics and music.
And then I realized I really

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didn't want any economics and I
I didn't really need to have

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that part in my, my bachelor's
degree.

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But when I did leave college and
I moved out to San Francisco, I

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did not feel comfortable not
having a job because singing

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gigs are unpredictable.
Sometimes you have lots and

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sometimes you have none.
So that's when I started working

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at UCSF and I was working just
part time supporting the

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department at the time.
Finding audition notices was I

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think the best resource was a
classical singer.

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They have their magazine and
they also have their website

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where you could look up
auditions.

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But it was it was it was tough.
You know, finding a study church

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job was helpful.
It was helpful in that you're

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constantly learning new music
and you're constantly singing

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and you meet you meet other
singers out there.

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Tell me about UCSF.
How did you, of all the many

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things you could have done, how
did you land at UCSF?

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Craigslist.
There was an ad on Craigslist

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for a part time job.
Specifically, I was looking for

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something part time that offered
health insurance and that's what

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this job was.
I was living, and I still do

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live in the Sunset and the
position was at the Parnassus

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campus, so it was walkable, easy
to get to, flexible, and it

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allowed me to work half a day
and then come home and practice

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or go to rehearsal or whatever I
needed to do for this rest of

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the day.
So you were in the chorus at

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Opera San Jose, and then you
were in the opera chorus for San

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Francisco Opera for over 20
years.

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And you know, you and I
overlapped.

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I was in the marketing
department there in 2005 to

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2008, and I had a few friends in
the chorus and it always seemed

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like such a wild job with the
costumes and the sets and and

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being on call for pretty much
the entire season.

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I mean most operas.
Have.

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Choruses.
What was it like performing in a

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a world class opera company?
I will never forget my very

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first performance.
We were doing Cavalerio,

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Rusticana and Pagliacci, and
we're waiting for the curtain to

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go up.
And I remembered that high

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school story that I told you
about.

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I hadn't yet had that ballet
experience, but I, you know, and

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I just couldn't, I kind of
couldn't believe that I was

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hired and that I was there at
this company that is world

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renowned, one of the top
companies in the whole wide

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world.
I, I was, I was stunned and

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starstruck and in awe of the,
the building and the production

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quality and everybody's voices.
All of you know the the chorus

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is filled with soloists, people
who could have had careers if

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they if they wanted to, in
various places.

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It's it's, it was amazing.
What are some highlights that

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you remember from your time over
the many years?

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Let's see.
I think it was my second season.

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I was in Eugene Onegin and the
costume fitting was unreal.

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I think I had three costumes.
But there's a scene in Eugene

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Onyegen that is a big ball
scene, a big and you know, the

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men are all in tails and with
white tie and everything and the

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women are in these most amazing
and ridiculous ball gowns.

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My hoop skirt, I'm 52 and my
hoop skirt was probably whiter

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than I am tall.
It was huge.

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And it was, the dress was all
white.

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They put on white gloves and all
this, you know, dripping with

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diamonds, not real diamonds, but
just dripping with jewelry.

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I, I, I, I could not believe.
I felt like a, like a doll being

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dressed up.
It was, it was incredible.

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That's definitely a highlight.
Let's see.

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My husband is also a singer and
so he and I were both in the

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opera chorus for a few years
together.

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We did a production of
Mfistofile by Boito.

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That was wild.
The range of costuming is from

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A-Z and maybe a is our naked
suits that we wore.

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OK, I don't remember this
production.

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So there was a.
There was a scene like in the

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Valpargus knocks in the sort of
the the Limbo of Heaven or Earth

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and Hell where we're all dressed
as partygoers, but naked

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partygoers with some costume
pieces.

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We were not naked.
We were not naked.

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We we had flesh colored body
suits that had some anatomy

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drawn on them.
Some men had appendages, so not

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there were also children in the
show and during this scene

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before and after, there was a a
certain amount of cushion time

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before and after the scene.
The children were kept up on the

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5th floor in the chorus room,
nowhere near any of us.

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Because when you looked at these
costumes from a distance, they

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looked very real.
That was wild.

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That was absolutely wild.
I.

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Love it.
What was it like in those many

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years where you would be getting
on stage at the War Memorial

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Opera House in the evenings?
What were your days like?

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Like at USFSF?
Would you talk about the operas?

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Did everyone know you were an
opera singer?

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Give us a glimpse into your
daytime life.

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So I was in the opera Chorus for
22 seasons.

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Three of those seasons were as a
full time chorus member and then

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the rest were as a part time
chorus member.

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So the years that I was full
time, I was still working.

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I maintained my job at UCSF,
which made for very long days.

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Especially the last time I was
full time was in 2022.

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That's when I see I, I had been
a program manager at UCSF

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running the biophysics graduate
PhD program.

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I started doing that in 2019.
So in 2022 I was doing that and

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the full time job at the opera,
very long days I would work, you

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know, this was still sort of
that limbo COVID time.

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So I was working, I was able to
work remotely more.

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And so I think I would start my
days when I was I would start my

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day at 8:00 and then I would
work until I had to go to the

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Opera House.
And then I would usually have

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in, at least in the beginning of
the season, it's mostly musical

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rehearsals.
I would have musical rehearsals

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usually between 3:00 and 5:00
PM.

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And then from 5:00 to 6:30 we
have our dinner break.

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So I would hop on my laptop and
do more UCSF work while eating

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my dinner.
And then we would have more

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rehearsals from 6:30 to 9:30
when we got into performances

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and also staging rehearsals that
would sometimes go until 11 at

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night.
So it's like, go home, get ready

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for bed and hurry up and sleep.
You can fall asleep quickly.

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Sorry, there were very long
days.

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But as I explained to my nephew,
he said to me one time, Auntie

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Nicole, why do you work so much?
How do you work so much?

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And I said the end of my day is
like dessert.

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It's, it's work.
It's not that it's easy and I'm

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just hanging out, but it's when
when it's something that feeds

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your soul, it's really easy,
easy to keep going.

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Let's take a moment to reflect
on this question.

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What do you do that feeds your
soul?

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Are you an Ampersand?
Looking for community

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Find out more about the cohort

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jessica1.com.

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Now back to the show.
In the last few years, you've

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pivoted more to recitals, and
last summer you did a show

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called Places We Want to Visit.
You had five performances of

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this program, and the fourth
performance was on Oahu at the

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tarot farm that your cousin
runs.

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What made this performance
particularly meaningful to you?

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That was just such a special
day.

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The whole event really blended
family and my passions.

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My family's really important to
me.

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Growing up in Hawaii, you
typically have a huge extended

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family.
So you know, my parents were

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there, my aunties and uncles,
but then my my cousin's cousins

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and my auntie's cousins.
And it just, and having it at

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this Taro farm, I have to tell
you about this farm.

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It Taro farm sounds quaint.
What it really is, is a ancient

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Hawaiian agriculture practice
that is being resurrected in

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ancient Hawaii.
They would divide the island up

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into wedges.
Like think of a pie and each

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each piece of the pie wedge.
So it included the mountain down

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to the sea.
So you got all of the

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agriculture that you could have
from the mountain, you know,

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trees and fruits, maybe some
pasture all the way down to fish

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ponds and marshlands, marshlands
and fish ponds for Taro farming,

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which is a huge staple in the
Hawaiian diet.

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And then they would have the
fish ponds beyond that just by

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the Ocean's edge.
And so this Taro farm is part of

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that old process.
It was called an ahu Puaa.

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And across across the street
from the Taro farm is actually a

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fish pond that my cousin also
helped develop.

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The Terrell farm has been there
for centuries.

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It was inundated with mangrove
for many, many years.

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There's a a bridge that we would
always have to drive over in

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order to get to school, to get
to Kaneohe town.

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Every day we would drive over
this bridge at least once.

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And it was on either side of the
bridge was just really, really

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dense mangrove.
And when they removed that to

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restore the font to tarot patch
and to restore the fish ponds, I

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had no idea what was back there.
It's, it's, it's so stunning.

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The.
The.

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How have you seen your identity
as Hawaiian, as biracial come up

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in your journey as a musician
and what you're studying now?

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The first thing I want to just
say is I am not Native Hawaiian

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and it's a something that is not
widely understood in that, you

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know, if you are from America,
you would never say you're

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Native American, right?
That's a very distinct ethnic.

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Group or.
Collection of ethnic groups.

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So I would never say that I'm
Hawaiian because that refers to

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somebody being native Hawaiian.
I'm from Hawaii, that's what I

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say.
So, but being biracial, I'm

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being from Hawaii, is it informs
who I am.

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It is it is at the root of who I
am.

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And this next recital that I'm
planning has a theme that is

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called Songs of Our Forebears.
And so we're going to the plan

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is to do a set that reflects my
guitarist Sharon Wayne's

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heritage.
She's Ashkenazi Jew.

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So we're looking at maybe some
klezmer, maybe some Russian

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music.
And then my side is I'm half

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Japanese and half Northern
European, so there's a lot to

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choose from there.
And so I'm, I, I'm choosing some

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French Huguenot music, which is
really obscure from my Japanese

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side.
I really was hoping to find

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music from the Japanese
internment camps.

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That's where my father was born.
I'm the music that I, I, I've

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learned of is it's a lot of big
band, which is great, but it's

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hard to do with a guitarist and
just a vocalist.

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So I'm actually starting to look
at music from the sugar

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plantation days in Hawaii.
And then also maybe some songs

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from where each of my
grandparents were from.

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And then I will also do another
set in Hawaiian.

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I have a few songs that are that
I've chosen that are.

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Partially in English and
partially in Hawaiian.

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Hawaiian and their songs from,
you know, maybe like the 70s and

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80s.
Lovely.

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It sounds wonderful.
What do you hope your audiences

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will take away from this
program?

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I think there's a little
education that can be found

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there.
I, I've realized in planning

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this one that it could be a
dissertation.

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So I'm trying to not bite off
more than I can chew.

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But I, you know, I think
learning about other cultures is

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so important, especially these
days.

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I think learning about their
music can make it more

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accessible.
And I think that when you when

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one chooses A recital program,
if the music really speaks to

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00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:59,280
the performers, if it has a lot
of meaning to to them, it'll

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come across as interesting.
Yeah, I think you're spot on.

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00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:10,280
I want to talk a little bit more
about your role at UCSF.

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You started out part time there.
Now you're the program manager

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for the PhD program.
In 2022, you were awarded the

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00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:24,400
Chancellor's Award for
Exceptional University Service,

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00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:27,640
and you mentioned that the
nomination included letters of

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support from faculty and
students.

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What did it mean to you to
receive this honor?

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00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:39,480
It blew me away.
I, you know, I had seen this

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00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:43,360
award being announced every year
and didn't really think too much

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00:21:43,360 --> 00:21:44,720
about it.
Like, oh, that's nice for that

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00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:48,200
person, that's great.
But you don't, you don't really,

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00:21:48,360 --> 00:21:52,080
unless you're at the awards
ceremony or unless you know the

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00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:55,320
person, you don't really know
all that goes into the

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00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:59,440
nomination and the conviction
that those who are nominating

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00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:02,520
you have to have in order to
submit this package.

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00:22:05,120 --> 00:22:09,560
Part of my goal as a graduate
program manager is, well, the

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00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:12,720
big goal is to get, get students
through, to finish with their

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00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:16,680
PhD.
And along the way, people run

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00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:20,520
into all sorts of hurdles.
And my goal is to just be there

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00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:26,120
for them and help them.
And the, the, the words of

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00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:32,480
support in this nomination
package confirm that I, I'm, I'm

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00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:36,680
meeting my goal.
But it was so encouraging also

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to know that I, I'm making a
difference in these lives.

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00:22:41,360 --> 00:22:46,640
And you know, to boot, these
people are researching things

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00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:50,280
that make all of our lives
better on some level there

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00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:54,880
because it's it's basic science
and a lot of it goes in the

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00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,160
direction of pharmaceuticals.
Not all of it, some of it it's

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00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:01,760
in other therapies, but you
know, it's all in service of

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00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:05,680
medical science.
When you think about your life

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00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:10,880
and how you've chosen the
administration side and the

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00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:16,080
singing side, what skills or
similarities do you see between

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00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:19,800
these two worlds?
What ties them together?

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00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:27,600
That's a really great question.
I often think about this as a

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00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:31,520
performer.
You have to know how to pivot,

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00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:37,520
you have to know how to be
nimble, you have to know how to

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adapt on the fly.
I've done a lot of educational

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00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:47,520
work where you going to schools
and you perform a show that's

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been rehearsed, but there's
always new variables, whether

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it's the students that you're
teaching who are involved in the

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00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:57,720
show and what they might say or
what they might forget or what

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00:23:57,720 --> 00:23:59,720
they might ad Lib, which is
always super fun.

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00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:03,240
But also the space that you're
going to be performing in is

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00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:06,760
never the same.
So you have to be flexible, you

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00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,560
have to be able to pivot, you
have to be nimble.

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00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:14,160
In administration.
There are certain things that

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00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:21,520
seem like they should be
prescribed and regular, but they

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00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:23,400
never are.
They never are.

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00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:25,920
There's always, there's always
variables.

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00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:30,280
And of course, whenever dealing
with other humans, there's

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00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:34,640
always nuance and variables.
And I, I, I, I often think about

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00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:39,400
how my training as a, as a
musician, as a performer has set

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00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:43,600
me up well to do my
administrative job, to think on

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00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:49,160
the fly.
And I think also empathy, you

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know, you as a performer, you
want to be, you want to show

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00:24:52,120 --> 00:24:55,040
empathy.
And I think that also helps with

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00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:58,160
graduate students who are trying
to get through a really, really

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00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:02,680
rigorous program.
Yeah, absolutely.

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00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:09,880
One of the goals of this show is
for us to collectively create

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00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:14,680
the Ampersand Manifesto,
defining principles for leading

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00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:18,080
these types of lives.
What are some principles that

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00:25:18,120 --> 00:25:23,560
you live by?
I'm looking at a whiteboard that

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00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:27,920
is above my desk.
We often do these community

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00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:31,920
circles with our first year
graduate students and we have to

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00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:37,320
pick words that represent us.
And I think they could also

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00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:40,480
answer your question.
So I have 3 words written up

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00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:46,400
here. 1 is harmony, open
mindedness, and compassion.

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00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:52,360
And I would say those are three
guiding words or principles in

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00:25:52,360 --> 00:25:55,640
my life.
Nicole, it's been wonderful

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00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:59,960
talking with you listeners.
Stay tuned for Nicole's upcoming

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00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:02,520
recitals.
You can follow her on Instagram

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00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:06,640
at Sunset Gamer Babe, and we'll
link to that in the show notes.

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00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:13,000
If you liked this show, share it
with your friends and fellow

361
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:17,200
ampersands and make sure to hit
the follow button to be notified

362
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:21,760
when new episodes drop.
It would mean the world to us if

363
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:24,200
you took two minutes to rate and
review the show.

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00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:29,360
Just go to the main show page on
Apple Podcasts or Spotify and

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00:26:29,360 --> 00:26:33,520
look for the stars.
I had a chance to listen back on

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00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,360
my interview with Nicole, and I
want to share a few key

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00:26:36,360 --> 00:26:41,160
takeaways.
One, it's so heartwarming to see

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00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:45,000
how Nicole is weaving in her
identity and background into her

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00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:47,400
artistry in this chapter of her
life.

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Looking back at where her
ancestors came from and not only

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performing their songs but also
in the places themselves.

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00:26:58,360 --> 00:27:02,480
This is so meaningful and a
beautiful homage to everything

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that came before.
I'm so excited for her next

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00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:08,200
recital and what she'll learn
about herself through the

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00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:15,760
process. 2 The idea of empathy
being a key skill that artists

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00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,600
develop.
Here's the definition of

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00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:22,880
empathy, the ability to
understand and share the

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00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:28,280
feelings of another.
As an artist, this really is our

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00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:33,920
work to comprehend the meaning
of what we perform or create and

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00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:37,440
also to translate that empathy
to the audience.

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00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:42,960
Being a singer is a constant
practice of empathy, and that

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00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:49,640
empathy can be applied in all
other areas. 3 Nicole brought up

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00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:54,080
several times how she's really
felt seen by this term.

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00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:57,960
Ampersand being biracial and
having dual careers.

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00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:03,040
This really is my hope with this
show and the community work I do

386
00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:08,760
with the cohort for more people
to feel seen and for all of us

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00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:12,200
to embrace our Ands, whatever
they might look like.

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00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:15,080
It's always and I'm never just
one thing.